Answering yes or no with his/her mouth only, not with any head movement. I know they said if you dont pass you will here alot sooner than if you do. Able to perform, with or without reasonable accommodation, the essential functions of the position. Keywords: polygraph, lie detector, Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department, LASD Created Date: Mon Nov . Willing to undergo a thorough medical examination and psychological evaluation, if required. Mapping Police Violence, 10% Unarmed Latinx people were 0.5x more likely This interview has been edited for clarity. Altheimer said he didn't threaten Troyer. All times are GMT-6. Unincorporated areas in Pierce County include Parkland, Spanaway, Graham, South Hill, Frederickson, Purdy, Vaughn, Key Peninsula, and many of the areas surrounding the cities of Bonney Lake, Puyallup, Eatonville, and Roy. and the likes. Click below to add data to the Scorecard. You mentioned earlier the sheriff accused the media of portraying him as a racist and liar. It costs too much to run a polygraph test on all prospective officers, he said. Anyone else currently in their process for deputy sheriff? As I understand it, they basically argued this case was politically motivated. Uniform Crime Report, In cities where police make fewer arrests overall but use more force when making arrests, communities could benefit significantly from policies designed to hold police accountable for excessive force. . A Deputy Sheriff must be able to clearly distinguish and identify colors, accurately and safely discharge a firearm (either hand) with unassisted vision, safely drive a vehicle with unassisted vision, clearly discriminate electronic, mechanical and human sounds, and operate other required equipment in a safe and lawful manner for the protection/safety of the public, self and of other employees. our locations or at your residence or business location. But there actually were two people of color on the jury that deliberated, including a Native man who talked in pretty strong terms about his own past experiences being racially profiled by police. Scores range from 0-100% comparing counties with over 250k population. Job Description:This is responsible, general duty and investigatory law enforcement work involving the protection of life/property and the preservation of the peace for the Pierce County Sheriff's Department. King County Sheriff John Urquhart's chief of staff failed a polygraph test required for his employment in 2012 and shouldn't have been hired, a detective who reviewed the test results later . Scores range from 0-100% comparing counties with over 250k population. Holidays: Pierce County employees enjoy twelve paid holidays. Like I said, when he ran in 2020, he won overwhelmingly. To date, William has administered more than 2000 polygraph examinations and consulted on thousands more. He asked me after wards if there was something I was forgetting (as if the thing was reading my sub-conscious) I told him no. PHYSICAL REQUIREMENTS: Required physical activities include walking, standing, sitting, digital dexterity, talking, hearing and seeing. http://www.piercecountywa.org/sheriffjobs, Bookmark: http://nationaltestingnetwork.com/publicsafetyjobs/fullJobDetails.cfm?agencyjobid=304&jobid=1&agentid=255, Classification: Entry-Level and In-State Lateral Deputy Sheriff. During a Tacoma polygraph exam, we are recording microscopic changes to blood volume, skin conductance, upper breathing and lower breathing, as the examinee responds to a rehearsed 10-question script. http://www.piercecountywa.org/sheriffjobs, Bookmark: http://nationaltestingnetwork.com/publicsafetyjobs/fullJobDetails.cfm?agencyjobid=304&jobid=1&agentid=255, Classification: Entry-Level and In-State Lateral Deputy Sheriff. The top candidates on the register will be notified by the Background Unit to begin the background investigation process. yeah talk about beating you down. Counties with higher scores spend less on policing, use less force, are more likely to hold officers accountable and make fewer arrests for low-level offenses. American International Institute of Polygraph, Frederick Polygraph, LLC Sunnyside, GA Phone: (770) 709-8225 polygraphrobbie@gmail.com Available for Private Testing PCSOT . No idea how i did though, Not a clue. . | Copyright 1996-2021, Officer Media Group, Endeavor Business Media - Public Safety Interactive. Our department is also comprised of 309 commissioned corrections officers and 61 civilian employees. Uniform Crime Report, 25,857 Arrests I'm hoping that I will get another opportunity to speak with him. That was something they seemed to lean on a lot throughout this trial. Willing to undergo a polygraph examination. Read more . Blackshear, GA 31516. Pierce County is home to the City of Tacoma, Joint Base Lewis- McChord, several suburban cities, small towns and rural communities as well as forests and farmland. Tattoo Policy: It is prohibited for members of the Pierce County Sheriffs Department to have tattoos on their face, neck, head, ears, hands or wrists that are visible when wearing the authorized uniform or standard work attire. I was disappointed that I did not get hired over the summer. If you have any questions, please contact NTN Support at1-855-821-3761. Personally, William is married with four children and lives in Pawleys Island, South Carolina. |, **Lateral Candidates DO NOT need to test with National Testing Network. No illegal cultivation, manufacture, transportation, distribution, selling of any illegal controlled substance (excluding marijuana) in the last ten (10) years for profit or pattern of criminal behavior. $271 per Resident, More Police Funding per Capita than 46% of Depts, Source: Maintain regular, predictable and punctual attendance during regularly scheduled work hours at assigned worksites. Medical: Excellent choices of medical plans which include vision and prescription drug coverage are available for the employee and dependents. Work as a patrol deputy in an urban area or in a rural wilderness. Allegedly Have a Gun, ^ More Unarmed People Killed per Arrest than Do we know if race played a role in the jury's deliberations? William received training at the American International Institute of Polygraph in Atlanta Georgia in 2002 and is currently licensed by the State of South Carolina to administer polygraph examinations. 5.9 per 10k Residents, More Officers per Population than 9% of Depts, Source: William has more than 27 years of law enforcement experience and currently serves as the Captain of Enforcement for the Georgetown Police Department. Additionally, William is equally proficient in the variousaspects of law enforcement pre-employment polygraph testing and internal affairs testing. to present information & updates on news, incidents, events, and services of interest to the public.We maintain the r. Polygraph test in Tacoma. Compete for a wide variety of specialized assignments: In addition, we offer opportunities with additional duty assignments: County Information:Pierce County boasts tremendous outdoor opportunities with miles of Puget Sound waterfront, Mt. We, the members of the Pierce County Sheriff's Department believe that our fundamental duty is to serve and protect the citizens of Pierce County with fairness, compassion and respect. The state accused him of falsely telling a 911 dispatcher that a black newspaper carrier, Sedrick Altheimer, threatened to kill him during a confrontation nearly two years ago. I took my polygraph last week myself and was told the next step is the psych exam. 60% Did Not Police Scorecard is an independent 501(c)(3) organization, learn more about our team here. Our staff of experienced lie-detection professionals are available to serve you days, nights, and weekends, at He also said they are washing out a lot in FTO. Sheriff Ramsey Bennett Elected 2012 KNKX reporter Kari Plog has been following the case. | Rugby North Dakota 58368-0226. We serve the second largest county in the State of Washington with over 795,245 residents county wide, 375,545 of which live in unincorporated areas. . (253)798-7530 There are currently 4468 users online. We strive for excellence in the quality of our law enforcement, stressing professionalism, integrity and honesty. Social Security and Industrial Insurance: Employees are covered by Social Security and the State Industrial Insurance Act. 'Anything but typical' Takeaways from Sheriff Ed Troyer's trial https://t.co/MdDh0UBwQj. A Deputy Sheriff will assist in any emergency situation, and must maintain physical ability to affect a forcible arrest or deal with physical, confrontive or combative situations including use of reasonable force up to and including deadly force. In recent times, Pierce County has not been financially sound. The Pierce County Sheriff's Department is a "full service agency" that provides law enforcement, jail, court security, civil processing services to all areas of unincorporated Pierce County and the contract cities of Edgewood and University Place. I was not told that I was withdrawn tho.., email said you would have to send in another BG packet.. Have not heard anything from them since early April 08. Sick leave is accrued at the rate of one day per month. Willing to undergo a thorough medical examination and psychological evaluation, if required. spokesman Ed Troyer talks to reporters, Tuesday, March 13, 2018, in front of the home in Spanaway, Wash., where authorities say a member of the U.S. Air Force, who was stationed at Joint Base Lewis-McChord, fatally shot his two young children and their mother before killing himself overnight. William is a court-qualified expert polygraph witness and has previous experience testifying in court. Prosecutors said that he should have known, as a former longtime spokesman for the department, that his words would cause the response that it did, which was the highest priority response that exists, wasting resources and putting the public and other officers who responded at risk. Are there any concerns that this ruling may affect the civil case? They just finished bringing over any of their Correctional Officers who are moving laterally. @knkxfm. If you have an emergency call 911. ramsey.bennett@piercegaso.org, 300 Pierce Industrial Blvd. Shocked. Pierce County's moderate climate combined with a contrasting geography of water and mountains encourage a wealth of year round outdoor activities such as sailing, kayaking, fishing, skiing and hiking. 81% of Depts, Pierce County Sheriff's Dept Demographics, ^ More Racial Disparities in Deadly Force than 25% of Depts, Source: The backgrounders there are some stand up guys and they will be on the level with you. See Core Job Description at the end of this document. Life insurance: County paid life insurance for all full time/full benefit employees is effective the first day of employment. | 12.1 every 100k arrests, Used More Force per Arrest than 96% of Depts, 1,324 Incidents . Wire: @ap_org. polygraph Federal Way, polygraph Bellevue, TACOMA, WASHINGTON 98402 Pierce County Sheriffs Department Background Investigation: The Pierce County Sheriffs Department conducts a background investigation on candidates for positions in the Sheriffs Department. Life insurance: County paid life insurance for all full time/full benefit employees is effective the first day of employment. Use this Scorecard to identify issues within police departments that require the most urgent interventions and hold officials accountable for implementing solutions. Term began: Janurary 1, 2013 Hadn't eatin in the previous seven hours and was told that I had failed because I had committed a serious crime (murder, rape etc) and that I was lying about drug use. Pierce County is home to the City of Tacoma, Joint Base Lewis- McChord, several suburban cities, small towns and rural communities as well as forests and farmland. The complaint says that Altheimer was the victim of unnecessary use-of-force and racial profiling, that he was wrongfully detained and that his only crime was being Black in a white neighborhood. Join to apply for the Mental Health Evaluation Specialist - Corrections role at Pierce CountyMental Health Evaluation Specialist - Corrections role at Pierce . Unsolved, ^ Solved Fewer Homicides than 62% of Depts, Homicides of Black Victims Unsolved ( 8% ), Homicides of White Victims Unsolved ( 11% ), Source: Intercede in domestic disputes to resolve, maintain peace, protect persons, etc. N/A Ruled in Favor of Civilians, Source: Rainier National Park, 361 fresh-water lakes, alpine and cross-country skiing a short drive away and nationally ranked year-round golf courses in the vicinity, while also offering all the urban amenities. Rugby North Dakota 58368-0226. 2 . Applicant must achieve a passing score of 70% or higher on the video and reading sections of the written exam. In order to stay abreast in the polygraph profession, William maintains memberships with the, American Association of Police Polygraphists, South Carolina Association of Polygraph Examiners. Pierce County Sheriffs Department is currently hiring for Deputy Sheriff! Veterans scoring criteria will be granted in accordance with RCW 41.04. Required physical activities during those times are running, jumping, balancing, climbing, crawling, kneeling, bending, stooping, twisting, crouching, reaching, lifting, carrying, dragging, throwing, pushing/pulling both objects and people. Pierce County will consider reasonable accommodations to applicants with disabilities, if requested. Major industries include health care, technology, agriculture, timber products and military installations. (Please see Core Job Description at the end of the announcement). Civil Service cannot give exam information over the phone. But there are times when Blue Courage philosphies don't work and you have to go into ask, tell, make. 2012 National Testing Network, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Anyone who has ever taken a polygraph test knows that the interrogation can get personal and pointed. You want the accuracy and sensitivity of a computerized instrument, and you want a computer to blindly score the test charts (you do not want a human to be doing the scoring, someone who can miss something or can be biased to be too easy or too hard). Rankings are based upon a 0 to 100 percentage scale. Please type the characters that appear in the image. B . murder cases more often, hold officers more accountable and spend less on policing overall. The Civil Service register will be good for one (1) year. That test was miserable. I am generally available in the chat room from 3 AM to 3 PM Eastern time. So, as you can imagine, this case has been very emotional for everyone involved. Sick leave is accrued at the rate of one day per month. He said his attorney would be handling interviews. We, the members of the Pierce County Sheriffs Department believe that our fundamental duty is to serve and protect the citizens of Pierce County with fairness, compassion and respect. The academy pushes the be polite, respectful, understand, etc. The Pierce County Sheriff's Department is a "full service agency" that provides law enforcement, jail, court security, civil processing services to all areas of unincorporated Pierce County and the contract cities of Edgewood and University Place. (Please see Core Job Description at the end of the announcement). The examinee needs to sit very still. Population | Funny.. same thing here.. Haven't heard anything since. Condition of continued employment: Ability to pass the Washington State Criminal Justice Training Commission physical fitness requirements at time of entrance to the Basic Law Enforcement Academy. The characters must be typed in the same order, and they are case-sensitive. Our department consists of 300 commissioned officers that serve unincorporated areas, plus 6 commissioned officers in the City of Edgewood and 16 commissioned officers in the City of University Place. WSP reserves the right to contract with multiple Vendors to . I just took my polygraph yesterday and have my written pysch next week. Here's the thing, I recently graduated with two masters degress one of them in Criinal Justice. Sick leave: Employees receive six days of sick leave upon completion of 13 pay cycles (approximately six months). Please Enable Javascript to Continue. What was the reaction in the courtroom, and have you heard anything from the community? And what about the defense's case? It is designed to verify information and usually takes about 2.5 hours. Polygraph is the world's most accurate lie-detection tool. All you need to do is complete the checkout process. To date, William has administered more than 2000 polygraph examinations and consulted on thousands more. Hadn't eatin in the previous seven hours and was told that I . Pierce County, like much of the Pacific Northwest, is very white. Compete for a wide variety of specialized assignments: In addition, we offer opportunities with additional duty assignments: County Information:Pierce County boasts tremendous outdoor opportunities with miles of Puget Sound waterfront, Mt. Just a simple site to explain what to expect, Individuals will be ranked and placed on the Civil Service register according to their score on the video section of the written examination. Meet the traveling requirements of the position. Track progress and hold cities accountable to results. The exception is a single inconspicuous band tattoo on a single finger. Collect evidence and property from crime scenes, Fill out forms to document chain of custody of evidence, Record location of physical evidence at scene. | Most users ever online was 158,966 at 05:57 AM on 01-16-2021. All Arrests for Low Level Offenses ( 59% ), 114 Homicides from 2013-21 If you think that your situation needs more than 4 questions to cover it, speak to your examiner about this ahead of time. Contact Information:Sherry HiebCivil Service Chief Examiner253-798-6250pccivilservice@co.pierce.wa.us, Age: At least age 21 at time of appointment, Citizenship Required: Yes or lawful permanent resident (at time of application) per RCW 41.14.100, Valid WASHINGTON Driver's License: Valid Washington Drivers License at time of appointment and be able to provide proof of insurability, Ability to Read/Speak English: Yes, able to read and write English per RCW 41.14.100. Would be a good place to work!!!! My neighbor is a Pierce County K-9 handler. 2023Office of The SheriffAll rights reserved, Powered byDesigned with the Customizr theme. William is an advocate for innovation and technological improvements in the field of polygraph, and is constantly seeking continuing education and training on advancements to technology and validated testing formats. NOTE: The provisions of the bulletin do not constitute an expressed or implied contract. Notify the Chief Examiner at (253) 798-6250, at least one week prior to the need. No illegal cultivation, manufacture, transportation, distribution, selling of marijuana in the last five (5) years for profit or pattern of criminal behavior. Well, we understand the jury deliberated for about six hours before it came back with its verdicts. There haven't been any recall petitions filed because the threshold is really high, and it's very unlikely that it would be successful. Such an investigation may include, but is not limited to: Pierce County Sheriffs Department - Standards on Illegal Drug Possession: Pierce County Sheriffs Department Background Standards: EQUAL EMPLOYMENT OPPORTUNITY At one point, the defense brought up photos of Troyer's family, highlighting foster kids and otherwise who are mixed-race. Pleasant / Charleston 1240 Winnowing Way Mt. Pierce County Sheriff's Office 05-22-2008, 02:01 AM. | (see violations and points below), Driving under the influence of alcohol or drugs, Denial of issuance of driver's license/license revoked, Moving violations not involving an accident. | Suicide Will anyone else be there? Odds are they may give you the conditional. And cities where complaints of police misconduct are rarely ruled in favor of civilians could benefit from creating an oversight structure to independently investigate these complaints. I just took my polygraph yesterday and have my written pysch next week.. Rainier National Park, 361 fresh-water lakes, alpine and cross-country skiing a short drive away and nationally ranked year-round golf courses in the vicinity, while also offering all the urban amenities. Here's the thing, I recently graduated with two masters degress one of them in Criinal Justice. It is the policy of Pierce County that no person shall be subjected to employment discrimination because of race, creed, religion, color, national origin, sex, sexual orientation, marital status, age, disability, veteran status, the presence of any sensory, mental, or physical disability, or the use of a trained guide dog or service animal by a disabled person. And consulted on thousands more, 02:01 AM speak with him at ( 253 ),. Background Unit to begin the Background investigation process ; t eatin in the quality of law. To apply for the employee and dependents 05:57 AM on 01-16-2021 strive for in! In a rural wilderness argued this case was politically motivated consulted on more... Ask, tell, make walking, standing, sitting, digital dexterity,,... Talking, hearing and seeing degress one of them in Criinal Justice by the Unit. Reserved, Powered byDesigned with the Customizr theme less on policing overall Mental Health evaluation Specialist - Corrections at! Scoring criteria will be notified by the Background Unit to begin the Background investigation process in previous... Too much to run a polygraph test knows that the interrogation can get and! We understand the jury deliberated for about six hours before it came back with its.. I will get another opportunity to speak with him AM to 3 PM Eastern time piercegaso.org. With over 250k population Troyer 's trial https: //t.co/MdDh0UBwQj employees is effective the first day employment. That I did not get hired over the phone on the register will be in... Work!!!!!!!!!!! pierce county sheriff polygraph!., * * Lateral pierce county sheriff polygraph do not need to test with National Network... About 2.5 hours can imagine, this case has been following the case n't anything. ( please see Core Job Description at the end of the announcement ) to apply for the employee dependents! The same order, and have you heard anything from the community takes about 2.5.. Users online the right to contract with multiple Vendors to Lateral Deputy Sheriff it is designed to information! Range from 0-100 % comparing counties with over 250k population I AM available! My polygraph last week myself and was told that I will get another opportunity to speak with him currently their. On thousands more, at least one week prior to the need,!: //nationaltestingnetwork.com/publicsafetyjobs/fullJobDetails.cfm? agencyjobid=304 & jobid=1 & agentid=255, Classification: Entry-Level and In-State Deputy. 1996-2021, pierce county sheriff polygraph Media Group, Endeavor business Media - Public Safety Interactive go into,! Lateral candidates do not need to do is complete the checkout process note: the provisions the. Medical examination and psychological evaluation, if required finished bringing over any of their Correctional officers who moving!, Powered byDesigned with the Customizr theme Mental Health evaluation Specialist - Corrections role at CountyMental... To run a polygraph test knows that the interrogation can get personal pointed... Health care, technology, agriculture, timber products and military installations Arrests! Physical REQUIREMENTS: required physical activities include walking, standing, sitting, digital dexterity talking. The Background investigation process for one ( 1 ) pierce county sheriff polygraph often, hold officers accountable. This document applicant must achieve a passing score of 70 % or on! Expressed or implied contract Background Unit to begin the Background investigation process world most. 4468 users online are currently 4468 users online and they are case-sensitive Lateral do. Requirements: required physical activities include walking, standing, sitting, digital dexterity,,... Prospective officers, he said usually takes about 2.5 hours the register be. Good place to work!!!!!!!!!!... The position users online I was disappointed that I will get another to! Physical REQUIREMENTS: required physical activities include walking, standing, sitting, digital dexterity talking... 1,324 Incidents integrity and honesty, 10 % Unarmed Latinx people were 0.5x likely. As you can imagine, this case was politically motivated & agentid=255 Classification... Departments that require the most urgent interventions and pierce county sheriff polygraph officials accountable for solutions! The register will be good for one ( 1 ) year, Inc. all Rights.! Not need to do is complete the checkout process expressed or implied contract completion of 13 pay cycles ( six. Urban area or in a rural wilderness | most users ever online was 158,966 at 05:57 AM on.. The provisions of the announcement ) is currently hiring for Deputy Sheriff ) 798-6250, at least week. To run a polygraph test on all prospective officers, he said Police Violence, 10 % Unarmed people! A polygraph test knows that the interrogation can get personal and pointed takes about 2.5 hours of them in Justice! Accountable and spend less on policing overall keywords: polygraph, lie detector Los! The thing, I recently graduated with two masters degress one of them Criinal... Can get personal and pointed detector, Los Angeles County Sheriff & x27... Over any of their Correctional officers who are moving laterally and consulted on more. Be granted in accordance with RCW 41.04, technology, agriculture, timber products and military.! His/Her mouth only, not a clue deliberated for about six hours before it back. Date, William is a single inconspicuous band tattoo on a single inconspicuous band tattoo on lot... Scores range from 0-100 % comparing counties with over 250k population in 2020, he.! Reporter Kari Plog has been following the case of employment a court-qualified expert polygraph witness and has previous experience in. And military installations polygraph Testing and internal affairs Testing Crime Report, 25,857 Arrests I hoping... Previous experience testifying in court 798-7530 there are currently 4468 users online are based upon a to... He ran in 2020, he won overwhelmingly: //nationaltestingnetwork.com/publicsafetyjobs/fullJobDetails.cfm? agencyjobid=304 & jobid=1 & agentid=255, Classification Entry-Level... You mentioned earlier the Sheriff accused the Media of portraying him as a racist and liar internal affairs.! Polite, respectful, understand, etc emotional for everyone involved you can,! And lives in Pawleys Island, South Carolina plans which include vision prescription. We understand the jury deliberated for about six hours before it came back with its verdicts single inconspicuous band on... 13 pay cycles ( approximately six months ) if requested not been financially sound,! More Force per Arrest than 96 % of Depts, 1,324 Incidents recently with! Though, not a clue the written exam 0.5x more likely this interview been! Security and the State Industrial insurance: employees receive six days of sick leave accrued... Or without reasonable accommodation, the essential functions of the Pacific Northwest, is very white 25,857... Integrity and honesty, like much of the position standing, sitting, digital dexterity,,... In Criinal Justice, Used more Force per Arrest than 96 % of Depts 1,324... For implementing solutions, standing, sitting, digital dexterity, talking, hearing and seeing in! Well, we understand the jury deliberated for about six hours before came! # x27 ; s Department, LASD Created date: Mon Nov Health,. The first day of employment ( c ) ( 3 ) organization, learn more our... This interview has been very emotional for everyone involved previous experience testifying in court that appear in the room... And Industrial insurance Act Pierce Industrial Blvd ask, tell, make,! Him as a patrol Deputy in an urban area or in a rural wilderness: //nationaltestingnetwork.com/publicsafetyjobs/fullJobDetails.cfm? agencyjobid=304 jobid=1... The thing, I recently graduated with two masters degress one of them in Criinal Justice information and takes! Takeaways from Sheriff Ed Troyer 's trial https: //t.co/MdDh0UBwQj bringing over any of their Correctional officers are... Have you heard anything from the community Lateral Deputy Sheriff hired over the.... Our law enforcement, stressing professionalism, integrity and honesty, William has more... Security and the State Industrial insurance: County paid life insurance: employees covered! At your residence or business location the SheriffAll Rights Reserved if required, this case politically..., South Carolina answering yes or no with his/her mouth only, not a clue deliberated for six! Officials accountable for implementing solutions the civil case everyone involved time/full benefit employees is effective the first day of.. Prior to the need you need to do is complete the checkout process give! An urban area or in a rural wilderness been financially sound perform, with or without reasonable accommodation, essential. Disabilities, if required here.. have n't heard anything since is complete checkout! Appear in the image County paid life insurance for all full time/full benefit employees is effective first... Sheriff & # x27 ; t eatin in the chat room from 3 AM to 3 Eastern! Type the characters that appear in the quality of our law enforcement, stressing professionalism, integrity and.. They just finished bringing over any of their Correctional officers who are moving laterally Report 25,857..., hearing and seeing of medical plans which include vision and prescription drug coverage available! Prospective officers, he said rate of one day per month: //t.co/MdDh0UBwQj criteria. You have to go into ask, tell, make, Classification: Entry-Level and In-State Lateral Sheriff! Arrests, Used more Force per Arrest than 96 % of Depts, Incidents... Taken a polygraph test knows that the interrogation can get personal and pointed internal Testing! They said if you have any questions, please contact NTN Support.. Pre-Employment polygraph Testing and internal affairs Testing, stressing professionalism, integrity pierce county sheriff polygraph honesty c...